Fox News as Lord and Savior
Dec. 27th, 2004 10:36 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
sisabetI gave Cappy a copy of "Outfoxed: Rupurt Murdoch's War on Journalism" (http://movies2.nytimes.com/mem/movies/review.html?title1=Outfoxed%20%28Movie%29&title2=Outfoxed%20%28Movie%29&reviewer=A%2e%20O%2e%20Scott&pdate=20040720&v_id=309213) for Christmas. Several interesting things then occurred. I am here to tell you about those things, but first, some history.
As most of you know, I was raised on a small farm in rural Kentucky. I'd not make the distinction of "rural" since I already said "farm" but this is Kentucky and even in the cities, you can live on a farm. There are many many things that frustrate me about my homeland. The ability to provide a person *space* is not one of them.
Like most of my cohorts I was raised in a conservative household that attended church on a regular basis. The church was a fundamentalist nondenominational Christian Church that was similar to The Church of Christ except we could have musical instruments. Do not confuse our church with The Disciples of Christ who split from The Church of Christ 2 centuries ago over the issue of music as well. As I was told by several relatives when I confided that I enjoyed the Disciples of Christ services I attended while I was in Memphis, "You might as well not even go to church."
So I don't. If the percieved "liberalness" of a congregation means that it is unfit or I am some kind of heathen hell-bound lost soul for daring to think that love and kindness and tolerance are important religious philosophies and central Christian tenants, then I have no comeback for that. Well, actually I do - but no one wants to hear it. I could quote scripture with the best of them and much like paper can cover rock - if you want to get down to the nitty-gritty, then the red-inked parts of the new testament should trounce Paul. If by raising this issue - I am automatically condemned to hell - well then what is the point? My argument is lost right there. Thank you for playing and I'll just be over here, sleeping in on Sundays.
At this point I have just entered into a state of silence about the entire thing. I will believe what I believe and continue to speak out about those things - but if people just don't care to listen, then I'll shut up, because even if they can not afford me the same respect, I'd be a hypocrite to insist that they hear me. Instead I'll try to emphasize the points we do share in common and when the time comes to disagree, point out that they raised me. I get this from somewhere. The fact that I have *always* been like this gives me credibility. I didn't go away to college and come back home all enamored with new ideas and ways of thinking. I have been expressing the same opinions and beliefs since I was four. My mother was big on pairs. She had a brunette daughter and she had a blonde daughter. She had a daughter who was a jock and a daughter who was a bookworm. She had a liberal child and a conservative child. We were into extreme representation of arch and/or stereo- types, I think, down to the fact that I adored brussel sprouts and Dawn hated carrots.
I tell you all this now because confronting the issue of "Fox: News" with my family was exactly like confronting the issue of religion. I am not saying that it was a similar experience - I am telling you it was *exactly* the same. I think this is interesting and useful knowledge to have, because I listen to NPR and sometimes watch CNN. I am more attached ideologically to NPR, but this is more of a theoretical fondness. I like the idea of National Public Radio more than the actual product, if I have to be honest. If you were to tell me that there is a documentary I should watch that systematically addresses some defaults of holes in CNN or NPR; I would naturally want to know the sources and would watch it critically -- but I'd watch it and enter into a debate. It would not *upset* me as a challenge to my belief system.
Perhaps if you wanted me to watch a documentary that accuses Joss Whedon of both plagiarism and xenophobia -- that would ire me to the point of stomach ache. But my love for Joss is very very deep.
This is when it hit me -- for many people (and not just my family) Fox News is their primary fandom - but unlike fandom - this is something way deeper than play. They care about these pundits and "anchors" and this is something you have to know. These people are family members.
Fox is very very good at what it does and the faces it projects are systematically created to make America love them. Not enjoy them or respect them or trust them -- they want so much more than that - they want your love. And they go about obtaining this devotion in very sophisticated ways. Patriotism -- something that is very necessary for any nation-state to survive and something that as a people we are intrinsically wired to feel -- it is a biological drive -- this need to belong to something bigger - to a collective and to believe in its goals as one, this has necessarily evolved in us -- and they tap into that. Attacking FoxNews at this point is akin to attacking America.
This explains to me why there is such an extreme adverse reaction to a discussion about the failings of this media to adequately do what it says it is doing, which is to report the news and let the viewer decide what to believe. Addressing the fact that this is just a lie told to make the viewer feel better about allowing a corporation to cookie cut out their entire perception of the world -- it would be like wanting to discuss if Mary truly was a virgin. It is pointless because just by bringing it up -- you are coloring yourself as an Anti-American leftist who probably wants to move to France.
So I am back at the drawing board as far as attempting to find ways open up a discussion. There is a way - there is a solution to any and all problems and I really believe this. I just have to figure out what that is -- and why my credibility is less than that of Bill O'Reilly to people who have known me my entire life. Perhaps that is it - familiarity and all -- but they have to know by now that while I am easily swayed on many little things -- my opinion on the big stuff has been carefully considered and evalutated. I have lists. I used logic. They *taught* me to look at things critically and to avoid fallacies. Well - someone taught me to do these things.
And unlike Cappy, who is exercising her adolescent right to "stir up shit" like wishing people a happy "Solstice" within earshot of my uncle. I asked her later if she even knew what Solstice was and all she knew was that Pagans celebrated it and yes - she said that to get a rise out of a conservative family member. She has not learned to choose her battles and much like Michael Moore, she does me no favors.
So it is frustrating. But it is a frustration that is familiar. At least no one calls me a Commie to my face anymore.
As most of you know, I was raised on a small farm in rural Kentucky. I'd not make the distinction of "rural" since I already said "farm" but this is Kentucky and even in the cities, you can live on a farm. There are many many things that frustrate me about my homeland. The ability to provide a person *space* is not one of them.
Like most of my cohorts I was raised in a conservative household that attended church on a regular basis. The church was a fundamentalist nondenominational Christian Church that was similar to The Church of Christ except we could have musical instruments. Do not confuse our church with The Disciples of Christ who split from The Church of Christ 2 centuries ago over the issue of music as well. As I was told by several relatives when I confided that I enjoyed the Disciples of Christ services I attended while I was in Memphis, "You might as well not even go to church."
So I don't. If the percieved "liberalness" of a congregation means that it is unfit or I am some kind of heathen hell-bound lost soul for daring to think that love and kindness and tolerance are important religious philosophies and central Christian tenants, then I have no comeback for that. Well, actually I do - but no one wants to hear it. I could quote scripture with the best of them and much like paper can cover rock - if you want to get down to the nitty-gritty, then the red-inked parts of the new testament should trounce Paul. If by raising this issue - I am automatically condemned to hell - well then what is the point? My argument is lost right there. Thank you for playing and I'll just be over here, sleeping in on Sundays.
At this point I have just entered into a state of silence about the entire thing. I will believe what I believe and continue to speak out about those things - but if people just don't care to listen, then I'll shut up, because even if they can not afford me the same respect, I'd be a hypocrite to insist that they hear me. Instead I'll try to emphasize the points we do share in common and when the time comes to disagree, point out that they raised me. I get this from somewhere. The fact that I have *always* been like this gives me credibility. I didn't go away to college and come back home all enamored with new ideas and ways of thinking. I have been expressing the same opinions and beliefs since I was four. My mother was big on pairs. She had a brunette daughter and she had a blonde daughter. She had a daughter who was a jock and a daughter who was a bookworm. She had a liberal child and a conservative child. We were into extreme representation of arch and/or stereo- types, I think, down to the fact that I adored brussel sprouts and Dawn hated carrots.
I tell you all this now because confronting the issue of "Fox: News" with my family was exactly like confronting the issue of religion. I am not saying that it was a similar experience - I am telling you it was *exactly* the same. I think this is interesting and useful knowledge to have, because I listen to NPR and sometimes watch CNN. I am more attached ideologically to NPR, but this is more of a theoretical fondness. I like the idea of National Public Radio more than the actual product, if I have to be honest. If you were to tell me that there is a documentary I should watch that systematically addresses some defaults of holes in CNN or NPR; I would naturally want to know the sources and would watch it critically -- but I'd watch it and enter into a debate. It would not *upset* me as a challenge to my belief system.
Perhaps if you wanted me to watch a documentary that accuses Joss Whedon of both plagiarism and xenophobia -- that would ire me to the point of stomach ache. But my love for Joss is very very deep.
This is when it hit me -- for many people (and not just my family) Fox News is their primary fandom - but unlike fandom - this is something way deeper than play. They care about these pundits and "anchors" and this is something you have to know. These people are family members.
Fox is very very good at what it does and the faces it projects are systematically created to make America love them. Not enjoy them or respect them or trust them -- they want so much more than that - they want your love. And they go about obtaining this devotion in very sophisticated ways. Patriotism -- something that is very necessary for any nation-state to survive and something that as a people we are intrinsically wired to feel -- it is a biological drive -- this need to belong to something bigger - to a collective and to believe in its goals as one, this has necessarily evolved in us -- and they tap into that. Attacking FoxNews at this point is akin to attacking America.
This explains to me why there is such an extreme adverse reaction to a discussion about the failings of this media to adequately do what it says it is doing, which is to report the news and let the viewer decide what to believe. Addressing the fact that this is just a lie told to make the viewer feel better about allowing a corporation to cookie cut out their entire perception of the world -- it would be like wanting to discuss if Mary truly was a virgin. It is pointless because just by bringing it up -- you are coloring yourself as an Anti-American leftist who probably wants to move to France.
So I am back at the drawing board as far as attempting to find ways open up a discussion. There is a way - there is a solution to any and all problems and I really believe this. I just have to figure out what that is -- and why my credibility is less than that of Bill O'Reilly to people who have known me my entire life. Perhaps that is it - familiarity and all -- but they have to know by now that while I am easily swayed on many little things -- my opinion on the big stuff has been carefully considered and evalutated. I have lists. I used logic. They *taught* me to look at things critically and to avoid fallacies. Well - someone taught me to do these things.
And unlike Cappy, who is exercising her adolescent right to "stir up shit" like wishing people a happy "Solstice" within earshot of my uncle. I asked her later if she even knew what Solstice was and all she knew was that Pagans celebrated it and yes - she said that to get a rise out of a conservative family member. She has not learned to choose her battles and much like Michael Moore, she does me no favors.
So it is frustrating. But it is a frustration that is familiar. At least no one calls me a Commie to my face anymore.
![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
no subject
Date: 2004-12-27 05:04 pm (UTC)And then I saw Outfoxed, and I knew he wasn't exaggerating one teeny tiny bit.
I've shown this movie to at least 3 different people and everytime it's the same reactions. "Oh my GOD, there is no way this channel is on the air!" "What the hell?" "How can they get away with this!" Ask
It used to confuse me how FNC, with its hyper-conservative, ultra-religious, self-righteous stances could be the same corporation that produces sleaze like "Joe Millionare" and "Temptation Island", etc. But then it all became kinda clear. IT'S ALL THE SAME THING. It's all sleaze, it's all porn, just different fetishes.
no subject
Date: 2004-12-27 05:50 pm (UTC)Another thing is that you tend to write your posts with subtlety. When high-emotion topics are addressed, I don't do well with subtlety. My brain can pretty much only handle slogans and chants at that point. Like, "Murdoch BAAAAAAD. Jon Stewart GOOD!" Not really helpful.
no subject
Date: 2004-12-27 09:13 pm (UTC)Remember in The Matrix when Morpheous offers Neo the different pills - one is knowledge and the other is basically ignorance with the promise of no change in his existence?
Now we know that people not born in the Matrix were not given a choice about what reality to exist in - right? You, you were born in Zion, my sweet. You are here because you have to be here - you cannot exist outside of Zion, you would wither and die.
As such it is hard to understand the appeal of the Matrix - you live in Zion - you know what is real and what is true and what is right and you cannot imagine trading that for a projected reality where your body is being consumed as fuel.
BUT -- say you came from the Matrix and entered Zion and suddenly -- nothing was ever real. You and your life are a lie and you are in constant danger with very little comfort. Is it any wonder that a lot of people would rather go back into the Matrix where they are a slave to the system -- but it is a predictible system.
It will hard for you - a child of Zion - to understand this mentality. But we have to figure it out otherwise the franchise will fall into 2 really crappy sequels and Liz will be left watching the last one screaming at Keanu: "WTF??!! Give me back my money, Bitch!"
You took the blue pill
Date: 2004-12-28 12:18 am (UTC)Inside Yourself
Will You Realize
The Truth.
There are no Matrix sequels.
no subject
Date: 2004-12-27 05:16 pm (UTC)I am really sorry that you find yourself so often opposed to your family on these issues; that sounds very difficult. But it's great that you're continuing to think critically and post about this stuff. It's fascinating, and it's helpful.
no subject
Date: 2004-12-27 08:49 pm (UTC)Actually, it isn't. This is how it has always been - it is just lately I have been wondering if it *has* to be this way.
But even I am conflicted about change - I don't want to upset my family - well not *most* of them. When I express an opinion, that is not one commonly shared, then I am upsetting them. I don't want to do that - but I hate to see people I care about duped. Then I have to wonder -- well they are happy being duped, so maybe I should let well enough alone... except this kind of attitude puts us all in danger and I don't want that either.
I think there is an answer because none of these people are *bad* or evil -- they are just frightened and tired and this is easy and has a lot more hope than the truth. It is just like Angel Season 5.
no subject
Date: 2004-12-27 11:56 pm (UTC)This puzzles me. My partner says the same thing: when we disagree, he finds it upsetting, some sort of indication that we are not good together, or something. For many years, I've been of the mind that disagreement is healthy, that varied opinions are just that: opinions. That differences need not be upsetting.
I guess this is the minority view, though. And of course, the more passionately held the opinions are, the more likely different ones are to upset people.
I see your dilemma, though. You don't want them to go on being duped, and yet you don't want them to be upset with you, either. I don't know what I'd do, in your shoes.
no subject
Date: 2004-12-27 05:53 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-12-27 06:25 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-12-28 01:06 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-12-27 06:20 pm (UTC)I got kicked out of a bible study group once for pointing this out.
Good times...
no subject
Date: 2004-12-27 06:24 pm (UTC)Fox is very very good at what it does and the faces it projects are systematically created to make America love them. Not enjoy them or respect them or trust them -- they want so much more than that - they want your love.
This is what I have such a hard time understanding. Because I look at these people and my gut reaction is "Assholes!" How does FNC get your relatives to love these assholes? Why do you think your relatives go along?
Back in the Reagan years I started to see a lot of what I called Asshole Politics, designed to appeal to the asshole in all of us. It seemed to me that this was very effective because everyone has an inner asshole which we have to constantly keep in check. Being told "it's all right to be an asshole" (e.g. "Greed Is Good") is thus relaxing, liberating, validating. Do you think that's what is going on with your relatives? Or is it something else?
no subject
Date: 2004-12-27 07:46 pm (UTC)This is what I have such a hard time understanding. Because I look at these people and my gut reaction is "Assholes!" How does FNC get your relatives to love these assholes? Why do you think your relatives go along?
Yes - and this is part of the core problem. We do not understand each other and there is no attempt to change that - mainly because we have such outlets as FoxNews that reinforce that people who feel/think/act as they prescribe are in no need of changing or attempting to understand any other viewpoint. There is no need to look at the complexity of a problem -- everything is in black and white and the good guys always wear white hats so you can tell them apart. The bad guys wear turbans though in this updated Western remake.
Asshole Politics (Like good ole Rush) are a part of the strategy. Bill O'Reilly and to an extent Sean Hannity both fit into this sphere -- but they are also extremely likable. Not to you -- but imagine you are a mother of two small children and you are not well traveled and you read - but mainly mystery novels and you did go to college, but the small state school down the road - and you hold a lot of the conservative views of the host mainly because you were raised to believe these things and you have never thought to question any of it. You grew up, went to school, married the boy you were supposed to and now you have children and a job and a mortgage and everything scares you to death.
And here is a place where the colors of the flag are everywhere. A place that tells you everything you ever needed to know about Amber Fry and just in time for her riveting testimoney. They reinforce that the world is a giant scary place BUT - you are surrounded by people that understand and value *you* - the things that are important to you - keeping your standard of living safe and protecting your family - are important to them and look who else cares...why it is George W Bush!
He feels exactly as you do and he will make certain to take care of you and yours first. And people believe this. They believe it because they want to believe it because when given the choice of truth or lie, people pick the most attractive option and that is always the lie.
So there is the *FEAR* that is steadily and vaguely infused throughout the day. The fear of the OTHER, the terrorist, the homosexual, the nonChristian, the Liberal -- these people who will destroy your life and everything you see around you if given half the chance and then you are told that something is being done -- that the people in charge just won't stand for this and they are working hard to ensure you will be okay.
You are told that Iraq is a success and the people that say otherwise are trying to bring down America. Any naysayer who may potentially gain creditability is systematically destroyed by several different reporters/shows on a steady diet of repetition. These anchors are attractive and they appeal to the worst in people by disguising it as appealing to the best. It is a shiny red apple filled with worms.
None of the regular anchors come off as assholes at all -- they are regular people, extremely attractive versions of regular people, and they tell the viewer what the viewer wants to hear and comfort him or her.
no subject
Date: 2004-12-27 07:12 pm (UTC)I mean, I knew that FOX was evil when they went about cancelling shows. I never watched the news because... at that time in my life, I never watched the news. It's only recently that I started, which was after I had already starting hating FOX with the passion of a thousand soul-hot Spikes.
You've got my support, for however much that may help.
no subject
Date: 2004-12-27 08:14 pm (UTC)Plus - I keep thinking that there is an answer and if I just keep at it and looking at it - then I will find the answer.
no subject
Date: 2004-12-27 08:31 pm (UTC)Thank you, for providing the insights you have into large parts of America that have baffled me and my relatives still up north (which would be, oh, all of them outside of parents and siblings), who pepper us with questions as to the "WHY?" of the U.S. political beast as though somehow proximity would mean we had an explanation.
I still feel like there's some huge Thing I'm just not getting, but you've made pieces of the picture come into focus for me.
no subject
Date: 2004-12-27 09:30 pm (UTC)I do think we have to *understand* how it works though, as a party, before we can address it and I think the people best equipped to understand how it works are the people who are surrounded by it.
See - *that* is frustrating -- watching talking heads and members of one's own party espousing a belief or a plan of action that you - a person embedded in the issue at hand - *know* will not work or is incorrect.
no subject
Date: 2004-12-27 08:46 pm (UTC)What I was wondering is whether you'd have better luck approaching them on fronts where you probably already agree. I guess health care is impossible because there's such a knee-jerk terror of "socialized medicine," but there must be other possibilities. For instance, do they think American troops in Iraq should be provided with decent armor? Do they think veterans' benefits shouldn't be cut? Do they think it's a problem that all the jobs seem to be getting shipped overseas?
And then, having slid in a wedge, you could possibly get them thinking about wider issues.
no subject
Date: 2004-12-27 09:01 pm (UTC)When it comes to my family - personally? No - this will not work at all because I am pretty much not allowed to discuss politics with anyone because it either *upsets* them or it will lead to an argument. Since I believe everyone has the right to believe what they want to believe -- it is hard for me to argue effectively for the right to argue. If the discussion is closed then so be it.
However -- our nation as a whole does not have the same luxury and I think some of the approaches you raise are interesting and will work because *everyone* wants the soldiers to be safe. Socialized Medicine is not the evil to the working class that a lot of the dems seem to think it is - there is no knee jerk except at the word "socialized" -- we were all raised very conscious of Communist Ideas.
Seriously - I watched a training film in first grade on how to tell if your school is overtaken by Russians. The first thing your new teacher will do is tell you it is okay to cut up the flag. This was 1981.
But *universal* healthcare and the right to medical care is something else entirely -- we just have to respond to the Republican Propaganda Machine that is beloved and trusted because they will make the lack of protective Armor in Iraq the fault of the democrats (who right now can't be at fault because we control nothing) and they will lie about healthcare becausae it is in their best interest to do so and they will smear anyone who says otherwise. Even thought they are in total control -- they are the victims. It plays well with a society of victims.
And if you don't believe we are conditioned to feel victimized - then watch an afternoon of talk shows. America is fast becoming the sum of our reality TV.
It is a difficult road ahead but we have to take it and we need to start by exposing the lies where we can and by talking about it. Also by not watching Wife Swap.
no subject
Date: 2004-12-27 09:26 pm (UTC)Red Dawn, man. *nods* I don't think our generation quite got the Godless-Commies indoctrination in the same way as the one before us, but the Soviet Russia was still totally the bogeyman under the bed. Interestingly, we were told the same things about Russians as people are being told about "the insurgents" today: that they hate us because we're free. *cues Sting, "Russians"*
I... I don't even know what to do. My knee-jerk reaction to the politics of fear is facts, but Fox and Rush and the Bush administration cast facts into doubt every single day. If careful explanation doesn't make a dent, I've got nuthin'.
(Interestingly, my dad and my sortof-maybe-uncle were cracking dumb!Bush jokes over lunch yesterday. Dad was a Ford-and-Reagan conservative, but hell he raised me and he's suprised me before. Good thoughts.)
no subject
Date: 2004-12-27 09:40 pm (UTC)It is set in a sunny schoolroom. The kids are about 2-3rd grade and all of a sudden a very pretty and young dark haired woman enters the room and says she is replacing their teacher. Their teacher had to go on a long trip. She does some subtle things like stops the kids from reciting the pledge of allegiance because it is not fun and then they all talk about how pretty the flag is and since it is so pretty then they should all come up and cut a piece off of it so they can each carry a bit of the pretty material around.
Then several men enter the classroom and whisper with the pretty teacher for a while. She turns back to the class and tells them that she has wonderful news - all of their parents have just given the school permission to take the kids on a wonderful field trip! They are going to travel overnight to a camp and it will just be the kids and they will have so much fun!
We were shown this film so that in the event of a communist invasion we would recognize the signs. After the movie shows there is a bit where the narrator comes in and goes over all of the little insidious things the teacher did to start the children on the path of becoming brainwashed.
My 6 year old brain took this to mean that all nice substitute teachers were communists and not to be trusted.
no subject
Date: 2004-12-27 11:06 pm (UTC)I remember watching that movie and thinking it was rather similar to what my parents/teachers already did - not about political topics - just in general.
no subject
Date: 2004-12-27 10:02 pm (UTC)I was shocked that such massive misinformation is tolerated and encouraged, and I was even more profoundly shocked when I mentioned "Outfoxed" to one of my Sci-Fi friends in an e-mail, and got a response from him which bordered on the profane and suggested that I had just poisoned his dog and buggered his mom.
No possibility of debate, no room for discussion. Finis.
Your religious analogy seems appropriate.
On the other hand, I'm reminded of Orson Scott Card's introduction to his collection of "religious" sci-fi stories, Cruel Miracles, in which he asserted that most of what passes for 'religious' literature in America is actually more properly described as 'devotional' literature. Card argued (quite effectively, given my own religious heritage, which emphasizes education and a search for truth) that a real religious discussion asks the Big Questions (is there a purpose for our life? is there a purposer? etc.), but that it is devotional literature and discussion which assumes that we already know all the answers and focuses on reinforcing and congratulating ourselves on already having the Only Truth.
The Fox News cult seems to me a purely devotional phenomenon, rather than religious in the sense of seeking after truth. And I've recently heard a scholar who's considerably more conservative than I am (David Dark, author of Everyday Apocalypse) touting his new book which suggests that any kind of unquestioning allegiance -- even to the U.S.A. -- is part of the "powers and principalities of this present darkness" against which Paul argued. Right or Left, if we've come to the point where we can't talk peaceably to anyone who doesn't already agree with us in every detail, he argued, we're pretty far removed from anything like real religion.
no subject
Date: 2004-12-27 10:25 pm (UTC)Seein' as how we both pay attention to the red letters --
Mark 6:4 -- But Jesus said unto them, A prophet is not without honour, but in his own country, and among his own kin, and in his own house.
Another way to look at it is "familiarity breeds contempt." You can be (and are, IMO) a genius, but your mama is going to remember changing your diapers and punishing you for sucking your thumb and being appalled at your one-time bad behavior at Aunt Pat's. She's not EVEN going to see that you're speaking the truth. It's SOOOO frustrating and exasperating, but you gotta keep keepin' on anyway.
[pet, pet]
OH! I'm at Jaime's for the next couple of days, and I'm watching I-Man till she gets home from work tonight around 2 am. I shall report!
no subject
Date: 2004-12-27 10:54 pm (UTC)First of all, I've never run across anyone else as an adult who was raised in the same church as I was. Although I think ours may have had a different slant, depending on the preacher at the time. I remember endless sermons about the evils of Catholicism and the end of the world. But there were only kind of non-judgmental reference to the fact that Paul may have been homosexual. I never remembering any anti-gay sermons or teaching. They were mostly about looking at your own sin and letting everyone else take care of their own business. However, I do remember in teen Bible study, giving the preacher's wife a particularly hard time, because I questioned most of what was discussed.
The other thing is my father's sudden addiction to Bill O'R's show. My Dad is 83 and a life-long news obsessive. He has probably an eighth grade formal education, but has always had amazingly broad range of knowledge and interest. He and I have come independently to the same opinion, usually on the liberal-to conspiracy-theory end of the continuum, on many topics for many years. (My mother refuses to discuss or hear about current events.) Dad has his own tv tuned to the news all the time he is awake. Because of his health, he now rarely leaves the house.
I could not understand why all of a sudden this jerk was Dad's new hero. After the first couple of times he praised the "no spin" and my automatic reaction--"that ignorant a***" or something similar-- we both knew not to bring it up. But I could not reconcile what I know to be my Dad's long-held thoughtfully-formed beliefs with his new attachment to this guy. What you said makes absolute sense. That's it. I never would have figured it out.
It makes me think, now, of those old televangelists. They appealed to lonely people and made them feel like family in order to make them feel good about sending them money. It had nothing to do with religion. I think in a way, this has nothing to do with politics. It's the same thing W has done. And the shopping channels. It has nothing to do with logical argument. It has to do with the need for human closeness and community. To me this is just unbearably sad.
I'm glad you shared your thoughts on this. It has helped me think about things a little more clearly.
Donna
no subject
Date: 2004-12-28 03:16 am (UTC)My father watches Fox News a lot too, and it makes me incredibly twitchy. He's gotten angry at me for making a running commentary on it, but not as heatedly as it sounds like your family does.
no subject
Date: 2004-12-28 05:18 am (UTC)I do not want to give the impression that there are huge family arguments about this -- quite the opposite -- there is very little discussion about it at all. My mom will listen to my ranting a bit -- I am more effective when I don't rant but I do get carried away sometimes and can't help it.
The adverse reaction I was referring to - the extreme adverse reaction - was a mainly a generalization about Fox's audience - anyone in their audience - when you challenge their dependance on this network.
In my family it mainly results in a plea from my mother to change the subject. Or my dad watching TV in another room. I don't live there so it isn't as if this happens a lot.
Huh. So what did they think of the whole Bill O'Reilly sex scandal thing, and Rush Limbaugh's drug addiction?
I honestly do not think they know or believe about the Bill O'Reily stuff (actually I know very little - not interested) and the Rush thing - I have no idea their thoughts.
no subject
Date: 2004-12-28 06:15 pm (UTC)from mom
Date: 2004-12-28 06:23 pm (UTC)Your dad leaves the room because he can not "hear" you...his upper range is gone and you do get a little high when you are passionate about something. At least it is a good excuse he takes advantage of...love you, liberal views and all....after all someone here did raise you to be a self thinker....and am very proud of the way you stand up for your beliefs....who knows, I was once a liberal in the sixties and may turn back to it yet....but I still do not like Kerry...
love, your misinformed but loving you mom.
Re: from mom
Date: 2004-12-28 07:28 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-12-28 06:42 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2004-12-30 04:54 pm (UTC)And pretty soon, if you're hurting long enough, you're taking them in anticipation of pain, not noticing the pain is actually dissapating as you heal.
I have never been addicted, but I understand exactly how it works. It's easy and tempting to sneak an extra pill "just to take the edge off" or to take one even after you're not really hurting as bad because you know you'll feel better.
(I've had numerous ear surgeries and delivered 4 kids. Believe me, I know pain)
no subject
Date: 2004-12-30 07:30 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2005-01-02 08:51 pm (UTC)This is really, *really* insightful. Wow. I am sitting here rethinking stuff on this basis.
Cool.