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sisabetSo I finally became aware of Kita's A/S essay at ![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-community.gif)
ship_manifesto. I guess it isn't that surprising that I missed it - cause it isn't like I am all "OH! Pairings! Gimmee!"
I have some ships, though, characters together that I prefer. Something about these two people (sometimes 3) together that strikes a chord with me.
She happens to pretty much distill the thing about the Angel and the thing about the Spike that I've been saying all along.
Actually, I've been saying it all along after Kita and hell, "Closer" was her idea so I'm pretty much her puppet. Her adoring, wackyass puppet and my nose comes off and is made of felt.
http://www.livejournal.com/community/ship_manifesto/3515.html
This is another thing that makes me feel better. You should go watch![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
gwyn_r's vid "Santa Monica" for more feeling of the better. Or more feeling of the Spike on Angel - they are one and the same.
Spike and Angel, Angel and Spike - I mean, don't get me wrong - I loved Buffy and Angel. I still adore Buffy and Angel, but my all-time longest lasting Jossverse pairing was Angel/Spike. Even now - while I long for a B/A reunion - it just won't feel right unless Spike is there. Even when I hate Spike (more on that) I still need him there. Kinda like Angel.
And sometimes I do hate Spike. Well not hate. Hate is a very strong word. But for me, a little of the man goes a long way. Most of the time I am filled with an affectionate tolerance of him. Sometimes I even find him attractive. I guess - a good comparison of my depth of feeling for Spike would be how I feel Cordy really viewed Angel - good-natured affection, familial love and occasional attraction that is then overcome by him being a constant annoyance. Yes - I'd think he was hot if he wasn't getting on my nerves so much. And then sometimes I realize that if he wasn't bugging me, I would miss him. This is the point where I have to acknowledge that Spike is not so much the mosquito buzzing in my ear as he is the inquisitive and precocious but very difficult four year old with ADHD that I am to watch for the summer. I may want to kill this child at times, but then he is so sweet and cute that I forget about it until I want to kill him all over again.
And if that is not a lot of mixed metaphors then I don't know what is. All said, while I am never not in the mood for Angel - my Spike needs wax and wane with the moon. Especially considering Wes.
Cutting to talk about Season 5 spoilers and how this is all, really, Lum's fault
Remember when we found out Spike was going to be on S5 of Angel? Remember there were people howling in anger and pain: The Spike Fen (HE WILL BE SECONF FIDDLE/ANGEL'S FOIL NOOOOOO!!!) the Spuffy Fen (IF SPIKE CAN'T BE WITH BUFFY, HE SHOULDN'T BE WITH ANYONE!!) the Angel Fen (WE HATE SPIKE!! WE HATE SPIKE!). I think my even grandmother had an opinion, but in all the drama, I forgot to ask Meme what she thought.
Because I was over the moon! I knew that Angel would be on the last ep of Buffy and I would daydream about how that had to be the ep where he would come to collect Spike to take him home. Dawn and I would talk about the Shipper-Race for the end of BtVS and would love how the odds-makers were saying that A/S was a dark-horse, but looking more and more likely as an ending. WHEEEE!!
It was a good time to be a fangirl. I daydreamed constantly. I storyboarded Sting's "King of Pain" and I came up with endings I thought that they could get by airing:
SPIKE STARES OUT AT DESTRUCTION OF SUNNYDALE, IN THE DISTANCE SUN IS JUST BEGINNING TO RISE. CAMERA PANS AROUND SPIKE TO HIS SHOULDER WHERE IT FOCUSES ON HAND LANDING THERE. CAMERA FOCUSES ON SPIKE AS HE TURNS AROUND TO LOOK UP AND PANS INTO HIS POV TO SHOW ANGEL. ANGEL NODS AND SPIKE RISES AND THEY WALK *AWAY* FROM THE SUNSET TOGETHER.
I mean - I freaking *vidded* this shot for shot in my head. It was lovely.
Of course it did not happen. But that was okay cause I liked the ending we got and even though I was actually aching from Angel and Spike being SOOOO close yet so far away in "Chosen," Joss was totally forgiven when he had Buffy wonder about the oiled wrestling out loud.
THAT IS MY GIRL!!!
And then Lum happened. Seriously - I was totally happy in my own world - the A/S world where you have the angst and you have the wacky and sometimes you have the angst served up as jam on wacky toast! MMMMMMMM Angst!Jam!!
And freakingsockkpuppett had to go and ruin it all. Yes, I was aware of Wesley. How could I not be - he freaking cut his own arm to feed Angel. And I died. I liked Wes a lot. I liked Angel and Wes as a pairing. But Wes is only human and Spike is a *part* of Angel - dammit.
And then Lum mentioned that in the Wes/Angel dynamic there was much evidence suggesting that Wes was the dominant partner and then my brain short-circuited.
Because... well, that was hot. Like really, really hot. And - yeah, Angel would possibly crave the chance to be submissive and also (probably) be punished. We already know he was having Wes tie him up. And if you think about the fact that (in my head) Angel has always been pathologically dominant (even with Darla - although there was some overlap) and also the fact that this has to be wearing on him - especially now, now that he is opening up his heart and caring about others for the first time and is feeling responsible for them and maybe just maybe he needs to give up some control.
And of course, we know that Wes can do this. Even Wes before Season 3, cause, face it - the bucket didn't come from no where. Our Boy Wes has a dark side and it is butch as hell.
So mix all of that together, add in a bit of "Wes is the first man Angel has ever loved" and stir and serve it all up on Lum's vid "So Real" and all of a sudden my massive, giddy schoolgirl daze about Spike-N-Angel came crashing down.
Cause if Spike was on Angel or Angel was on Spike (and I do tend to fall on the Angel is on Spike side) where did that leave Wes? And I just can't threesome them without cheapening the original reason I find Angel and Wes both hot and also gutwrenching - the love. There is obvious love there and it isn't like the vibe I get with A/S - where anyone you add is just another body but these 2 will continue on no matter. With Angel and Wes it becomes this intimate and scary obsessive thing and throwing in Spike suddenly seems very disrespectful of Wes. Because Wes is only human and it just isn't fair that he won't be with Angel for all eternity, but Spike will and that a freaking unfair advantage!!
The first moment I felt the need to protect Wes from Spike was right before VVC and it was while watching So Real and I felt it so strongly that I was shocked. It was this sudden anger toward Spike for daring to even look at Angel - Because there is a WES to consider. Whoa. That was strange.
And then it just got worse from there and I totally blame Lum. In fact - I remember a drunken conversation at last year's vividcon where we decided that if there was ever a guy that would let the subtext become text, it would be Joss and the first thing we wanted was not acknowledgement of A/S - but would be something between A/W - at the very least an admission of feelings.
And I had to marvel at the hell? When did that happen? And then it just got worse from there, but it is still manageagble mainly because I think we are the only peoole who find Dom!Wes sexy so there isn't a bounty of fic or anything so most days I am okay.
But then sometimes I remember that Wes died and Angel did end up with Spike and there was canonical acknowlegement and I have to remind myself that this is what I wanted for years. Cause I am still grieving over Wes. So much so that I irrationally blame Spike. And I know he didn't kill him - but now there is this vid that I just can't make. Cause Spike....grrrrrrrhhhh.
ship_manifesto. I guess it isn't that surprising that I missed it - cause it isn't like I am all "OH! Pairings! Gimmee!" I have some ships, though, characters together that I prefer. Something about these two people (sometimes 3) together that strikes a chord with me.
She happens to pretty much distill the thing about the Angel and the thing about the Spike that I've been saying all along.
Actually, I've been saying it all along after Kita and hell, "Closer" was her idea so I'm pretty much her puppet. Her adoring, wackyass puppet and my nose comes off and is made of felt.
http://www.livejournal.com/community/ship_manifesto/3515.html
This is another thing that makes me feel better. You should go watch
gwyn_r's vid "Santa Monica" for more feeling of the better. Or more feeling of the Spike on Angel - they are one and the same. Spike and Angel, Angel and Spike - I mean, don't get me wrong - I loved Buffy and Angel. I still adore Buffy and Angel, but my all-time longest lasting Jossverse pairing was Angel/Spike. Even now - while I long for a B/A reunion - it just won't feel right unless Spike is there. Even when I hate Spike (more on that) I still need him there. Kinda like Angel.
And sometimes I do hate Spike. Well not hate. Hate is a very strong word. But for me, a little of the man goes a long way. Most of the time I am filled with an affectionate tolerance of him. Sometimes I even find him attractive. I guess - a good comparison of my depth of feeling for Spike would be how I feel Cordy really viewed Angel - good-natured affection, familial love and occasional attraction that is then overcome by him being a constant annoyance. Yes - I'd think he was hot if he wasn't getting on my nerves so much. And then sometimes I realize that if he wasn't bugging me, I would miss him. This is the point where I have to acknowledge that Spike is not so much the mosquito buzzing in my ear as he is the inquisitive and precocious but very difficult four year old with ADHD that I am to watch for the summer. I may want to kill this child at times, but then he is so sweet and cute that I forget about it until I want to kill him all over again.
And if that is not a lot of mixed metaphors then I don't know what is. All said, while I am never not in the mood for Angel - my Spike needs wax and wane with the moon. Especially considering Wes.
Cutting to talk about Season 5 spoilers and how this is all, really, Lum's fault
Remember when we found out Spike was going to be on S5 of Angel? Remember there were people howling in anger and pain: The Spike Fen (HE WILL BE SECONF FIDDLE/ANGEL'S FOIL NOOOOOO!!!) the Spuffy Fen (IF SPIKE CAN'T BE WITH BUFFY, HE SHOULDN'T BE WITH ANYONE!!) the Angel Fen (WE HATE SPIKE!! WE HATE SPIKE!). I think my even grandmother had an opinion, but in all the drama, I forgot to ask Meme what she thought.
Because I was over the moon! I knew that Angel would be on the last ep of Buffy and I would daydream about how that had to be the ep where he would come to collect Spike to take him home. Dawn and I would talk about the Shipper-Race for the end of BtVS and would love how the odds-makers were saying that A/S was a dark-horse, but looking more and more likely as an ending. WHEEEE!!
It was a good time to be a fangirl. I daydreamed constantly. I storyboarded Sting's "King of Pain" and I came up with endings I thought that they could get by airing:
SPIKE STARES OUT AT DESTRUCTION OF SUNNYDALE, IN THE DISTANCE SUN IS JUST BEGINNING TO RISE. CAMERA PANS AROUND SPIKE TO HIS SHOULDER WHERE IT FOCUSES ON HAND LANDING THERE. CAMERA FOCUSES ON SPIKE AS HE TURNS AROUND TO LOOK UP AND PANS INTO HIS POV TO SHOW ANGEL. ANGEL NODS AND SPIKE RISES AND THEY WALK *AWAY* FROM THE SUNSET TOGETHER.
I mean - I freaking *vidded* this shot for shot in my head. It was lovely.
Of course it did not happen. But that was okay cause I liked the ending we got and even though I was actually aching from Angel and Spike being SOOOO close yet so far away in "Chosen," Joss was totally forgiven when he had Buffy wonder about the oiled wrestling out loud.
THAT IS MY GIRL!!!
And then Lum happened. Seriously - I was totally happy in my own world - the A/S world where you have the angst and you have the wacky and sometimes you have the angst served up as jam on wacky toast! MMMMMMMM Angst!Jam!!
And freaking
sockkpuppett had to go and ruin it all. Yes, I was aware of Wesley. How could I not be - he freaking cut his own arm to feed Angel. And I died. I liked Wes a lot. I liked Angel and Wes as a pairing. But Wes is only human and Spike is a *part* of Angel - dammit. And then Lum mentioned that in the Wes/Angel dynamic there was much evidence suggesting that Wes was the dominant partner and then my brain short-circuited.
Because... well, that was hot. Like really, really hot. And - yeah, Angel would possibly crave the chance to be submissive and also (probably) be punished. We already know he was having Wes tie him up. And if you think about the fact that (in my head) Angel has always been pathologically dominant (even with Darla - although there was some overlap) and also the fact that this has to be wearing on him - especially now, now that he is opening up his heart and caring about others for the first time and is feeling responsible for them and maybe just maybe he needs to give up some control.
And of course, we know that Wes can do this. Even Wes before Season 3, cause, face it - the bucket didn't come from no where. Our Boy Wes has a dark side and it is butch as hell.
So mix all of that together, add in a bit of "Wes is the first man Angel has ever loved" and stir and serve it all up on Lum's vid "So Real" and all of a sudden my massive, giddy schoolgirl daze about Spike-N-Angel came crashing down.
Cause if Spike was on Angel or Angel was on Spike (and I do tend to fall on the Angel is on Spike side) where did that leave Wes? And I just can't threesome them without cheapening the original reason I find Angel and Wes both hot and also gutwrenching - the love. There is obvious love there and it isn't like the vibe I get with A/S - where anyone you add is just another body but these 2 will continue on no matter. With Angel and Wes it becomes this intimate and scary obsessive thing and throwing in Spike suddenly seems very disrespectful of Wes. Because Wes is only human and it just isn't fair that he won't be with Angel for all eternity, but Spike will and that a freaking unfair advantage!!
The first moment I felt the need to protect Wes from Spike was right before VVC and it was while watching So Real and I felt it so strongly that I was shocked. It was this sudden anger toward Spike for daring to even look at Angel - Because there is a WES to consider. Whoa. That was strange.
And then it just got worse from there and I totally blame Lum. In fact - I remember a drunken conversation at last year's vividcon where we decided that if there was ever a guy that would let the subtext become text, it would be Joss and the first thing we wanted was not acknowledgement of A/S - but would be something between A/W - at the very least an admission of feelings.
And I had to marvel at the hell? When did that happen? And then it just got worse from there, but it is still manageagble mainly because I think we are the only peoole who find Dom!Wes sexy so there isn't a bounty of fic or anything so most days I am okay.
But then sometimes I remember that Wes died and Angel did end up with Spike and there was canonical acknowlegement and I have to remind myself that this is what I wanted for years. Cause I am still grieving over Wes. So much so that I irrationally blame Spike. And I know he didn't kill him - but now there is this vid that I just can't make. Cause Spike....grrrrrrrhhhh.
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no subject
Date: 2004-08-26 02:25 pm (UTC)It's shhh an open secret in fandom that I'm an S/X shipper (shh! I said shhh!) but when I can't get that (and let's face it canonwise and vidwise there's not much left to go on at the end of the day) I want Spike to be happy somewhere, and not playing third wheel to anyone in the sense of "Oh yeah, you, I've got this old family thing with, and the sex is fun, but Wesley has my heart." "Yeah, ok, that's cool, I'll just be over here sucking you or possibly him off and ignoring the fact that my one dream in unlife (under all the posturing crap) is to come first and best with somebody who loves me."
Thus I am utterly cool with A/W, and with A/S, but A/W/S stories tread a really thin line with me, and usually no matter how much I love them, even with the very good ones, I end up aching for Spike, and resentful of Wes.