sisabet: (Angel down)
[personal profile] sisabet
So I know that every now and then there will be a frisson in my fannish wall of insular and flame retardent material and some idiocy will slip through.

I am prepared for that. I am. I am, maybe. Possibly. Actually, I really have an extremely low tolerance for stupid people. This is why I can't tolerate message boards or most lists and and and... well there are a lot of dumbass people I have to deal with on a daily basis. Why in the world would I want to have to run into then in the place I go to escape...from them?!

And sometimes it is just - not a matter of intelligence - it is a matter of not getting it. Which is fine. You do not have to get it. I often miss things. I tend to not shoot off at the mouth about those things - but whatever. Don't get it. Don't understand. Don't reach enlightenment. Whatever. I will do my best to avoid you because, see - you not getting it will drive me insane.

And I know, know, know that I will not be able to make you see. I know this. I do. Oftentimes you won't actually be listening - you will be formulating your response even as I am working very very hard to explain this to you in very small words and sometimes with pictures. You will hear me but you will not understand. I know these things like I know my eyes are blue and I like my coffee with 2 sweet and lows and some milk. I can see into the future and I see me collapsing with exhaustion over the still thriving body of You Not Getting It. I cannot make you see.

I know this. But.

::sigh::

Here is the deal. I try to avoid these things by not joining lists, not joining a lot of communities and pretty much immersing myself with you guys - my fList. If something happens that I need to know - is someone posts an interview I need to see (like the recent LeGuin/SciFi thing) then y'all let me know, and I appreciate that.

And there are so many things out in the world today where people just don't get it. The banning of the United Church of Christs ads because they are inclusive, people commenting on Amazon reviews that they think it is an insult to call Spearhead a "Rap" or "Hip Hop" group as they don't consider those true forms of music and Mr. Franti, et al are obviously a Good Thing and not of that inferior genre, and people who think slash is funny.

These people are all on the I Don't Get It Boat and man I want it to sail, sail away. Sail far away from me. With Cartman singing "I'm saaaaiiilling away..."

But sometimes that boat gets stuck at shore. Sometimes people don't get that for a lot of us interested in slash the interest is in subtext - that it is a deeper reading of the material and that is fun. Also - some of us are just big Huge Romantics and want everyone to be in love and oftentimes when you look at your Big Hero Character and he is a man and you look at the one person who is consistently there and where there is genuine love - well that ain't the Rotating Female Guest Star of the week. It is the Staunch and True Best Friend/Partner who also just happens to be a man. Then sometimes you have guys who just can't die like Duncan and Angel and really - they are way to hot to be limited to just one gender. Ya gotta think - different rules and continuum's of sexuality apply when you live for hundreds of years and never age.

Since we are all textual/subtextual obsessives - most of us slashers *love* overt stuff - especially stuff from craptastic ages of comics where we constantly have to go "What?? They Said WHAT?? OMG - they had to know what that meant!" Because PEOPLE!! There exists a freaking Gay Code and it was fully in force back in the day. DUDE - just if you don't understand go talk to [livejournal.com profile] sockkpuppett or [livejournal.com profile] tzikeh or [livejournal.com profile] thebratqueen - and shit like that is part of our heritage as slashers - as people who look beyond the text for the additional information this is important.

In the case of DC comics - back in the day it was also very very strange and interesting and kinda hilarious. But not in the "tee-hee, slash" way - as in the "OMG - Superman and Batman and the tentacle creatures that did what???" way. You know - like Smart Adult Women.

And I know Lum and I made "Whatever" and yeah a lot of the percieved comedy of it has been "OMG !! Hilar! U made anGel So gay!HA!" or however it is that the kids are saying it these days. And Whatever is funny to me - not because Angel appears gay. Angel appears gay every day, all the time and in every situation. Open your eyes. "Whatever" is funny because he is such a freaking slut. And he is. And he is.

But like I said -- I try to stay away from people that don't get it. Cause I want to illuminate and share and talk and learn and grow and get Timmy off drugs and help Brandon stop gambling and perhaps introduce the boys over coffee. See? And I will drive myself nuts explaining something to someone who doesn't see it when maybe my energy would be better spent *expressing* what I do get so that one day - maybe - someone who is open to it will see what I did and go "Oh, wow. I get it."

That would be so freaking awesome. *That* is my New Years Resolution.

Date: 2004-12-17 08:23 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] tzikeh.livejournal.com
Sometimes people don't get that for a lot of us interested in slash the interest is in subtext - that it is a deeper reading of the material and that is fun.

Man, I just love you so much. And it's so true. And it's something I keep meaning to write about in the ollllll' lj, and just never do.

maybe - someone who is open to it will see what I did and go "Oh, wow. I get it."
That would be so freaking awesome. *That* is my New Years Resolution.


Ooooh! Can it be mine, too?

Date: 2004-12-17 08:48 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sisabet.livejournal.com
YES! We will be Resolution Twins! With Secret Super Powers and our powers will be unlocked in jewelry - mine in an anklet and yours in a bracelet! And we will have a catchphrase!

Date: 2004-12-17 09:02 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] tzikeh.livejournal.com
Can our catchphrase be "Hot Donuts!" ?

Date: 2004-12-17 09:27 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sisabet.livejournal.com
I was thinking the "Ollll I-Man shuffle" but you know - both work!

Date: 2004-12-17 09:37 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] tzikeh.livejournal.com
Form of - a hot donut!
Shape of - the Ollll I-Man Shuffle!

Date: 2004-12-17 09:06 pm (UTC)
luminosity: (MFEBV)
From: [personal profile] luminosity
My new year's resolution in 25 words or less:

To put with even less shit than I put up with this year.

It's simple. It's elegant. Or, to paraphrase Churchill apocrypha: More shit up with I shall not put.

Date: 2004-12-17 09:32 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sisabet.livejournal.com
This deserves a drink. Someone is making a stop at Ye Olde Liquor Shoppe after work.

Date: 2004-12-17 09:51 pm (UTC)
luminosity: (whap!)
From: [personal profile] luminosity
It was too simple and elegant, and now that I've had a nap, I shall rephrase: More crap up with which I shall not put.

Maybe I need a drink too.

Date: 2004-12-17 09:39 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gwyn-r.livejournal.com
I normally never see slash. It's the rare movie or show where it doesn't sail right over my head like a paper airplane. When I first hooked up with the Cannibals, Sandy looked at me funny when I talked about the 16 years I spent trying to find out what happened to the Professionals after Canadian TV stopped showing it before I found out there was the thing called slash, and asked me, "You mean, it just went... right..." and made a whooshing motion over her head. I went, yup, pretty much. Never occurred to me. Once in a while a show like Keen Eddie or Magnificent 7 comes along, or a movie like Fast and the Furious and I'm all, heee, slash! And I saw it! And stuff!

But most of the time I'm clueless. And it isn't the overt stuff that really finally makes me see it. I mean, all those things i cited, and others that I think of as teh Gay, have terribly overt stuff in them. But it's never those things that catch my eye, it's subtle undercurrents, the manner in which the relationships are cast, the chemistry of actors together (this is crucial, I think, because some actors have a shield around them in terms of the chemistry), the way the writers construct situations... there are so many factors that overt "gay"ness is kind of minor for slash.

I'm still largely clueless, but like they said on the Supreme Court about porn, I know it when I see it. Sometimes. ;-) And the people who will know it when they see it? They're your buds.

Date: 2004-12-18 01:23 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sisabet.livejournal.com
I can't explain what it is - but you *get* it overall - you understand where your friends are coming from and don't look at slash as something these gals must be doing because it is soooo funny to see Batman and Superman acting gay when you know - they are not.

I'm just bitter.

Date: 2004-12-17 10:53 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] kita0610.livejournal.com
It's like Brat told me once when I was getting into this argument with someone over the "just that once" line Spike said to Illyria. This person was all "intimate doesnt mean sex!" and I'm like, MORON andBrat said, "honey. these people will NEVER understand that that line WASN'T PUT IN THERE FOR THEM, it was PUT IN THERE JUST FOR US." And I just thought- yes. Yes that's it exactly. And I stopped emailing with the moron and had some pie.

Date: 2004-12-18 03:03 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] caille.livejournal.com
Kita...oh, very funny and true. My resolution: stop e-mailing morons, and have pie.

Love you too, sisabet.

Date: 2004-12-18 04:28 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] wrenlet.livejournal.com
Dude, they may as well have had a Joss pop-up box in the corner right before that line with a sign that said "SLASH-FEN, THIS IS FOR YOU! *MWAH*"

For reals.

Also, much with the love, Sisabet, but you know that already. Me, I've wandered so far afield on the slash side o' the fence that I'll smush people together in my head even when I know there's no subtext, just because I can. And because it's fun. And because I'm strange. But I'll totally admit the lack of justification so that's my out ;)

Date: 2004-12-17 11:02 pm (UTC)
ext_1843: (elitist)
From: [identity profile] cereta.livejournal.com
Can I join you in that resolution?

Oh, all right, I know: I run an entire web site that's about Explaining Shit to People Who Don't Get It. And I will continue to do so. But man, I'm hittin' a wall where I just don't want to deal with people who can't be arsed to find out something about the activity they're taking part in. I spend my entire professional life trying to convey stuff to people who often actively resist learning. I don't need it in my fun stuff.

Date: 2004-12-18 01:27 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sisabet.livejournal.com
See - if someone is truly puzzled and really wants to understand and will listen - I want to talk to them. It is these people who act like they want a dialogue but really all they want is for you to be the brick wall they throw their theories at and have no interest in listening. I have no patience for these people and I refuse to waste my time or energy any more.

Date: 2004-12-18 12:00 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] flyingtapes.livejournal.com
Was this from the [livejournal.com profile] scans_daily thing?

Date: 2004-12-18 01:07 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sisabet.livejournal.com
Well that was just the last straw. The guy who has serious issues with Batman even having sex - I dunno - it was the absolute wrong place for the discussion, but fine. I think Batman also has serious fucked up hangups about sex and one of those hang-ups is that he is attracted to Dick. And hey - Nightwing ain't bad either.

It was more the moron in the comments who kept saying how they have to stop themselves from commenting in the community "Not gay, not gay, not gay" and I just want that person to GO AWAY. I had to stop myself from commenting in caps FIND YOUR OWN SAFE PLACE TO SEE COMIC SCANS BECAUSE YOU ARE HARSHING ON *MINE*

See - I think if scans daily as a slashy comic scan place. I LOVE it for being a slashy comic place. Anti-slash bias upsets me there. It does not belong - it is like being in a strip club and you pay for a lap dance and you get and episode of Seventh Heaven instead. It is almost like that.

Date: 2004-12-18 10:17 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] flyingtapes.livejournal.com
Yeah, I get that. It is sort of a community created for fandom-comic people. And that person was kind of assy. Especially as it's not a discussion community really--at least not for that kind of theoretical stuff. Ah well. We sort of took it back, anyway.

Date: 2004-12-18 03:02 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] thefakeheadline.livejournal.com
I like your resolution, and I think I should emulate it. *nods* This whole thing is...hurting my head. I started the comm as a by slashers, for slashers thing, and it has just kinda exploded. It's *bizarre.*

Date: 2004-12-18 04:36 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sisabet.livejournal.com
YOUR ICON!!!

And yeah -- I knew it was your comm and I *knew* most of the people who were posting when I first joined and it really was one of the highlights of my day. I *still* like it, but like with any list or comm or anything that is really cool - the better it is, the more people are gonna show up.

And then you get the "tee-hee slash" or even worse the "ewwww slash" (I really think the tee-hee crowd is just another form of the ewww bunch, actually) and it pisses me off. I *love* how this comm functions and the posts there really do brighten my day. I don't think that a lot of the new people showing up there understand the whole by slashers for slashers thing. I mean - I don't know how they miss it - but maybe they think this is just a phase and pretty soon we will all go back to posting scans of Wonder Woman's breasts.

Date: 2004-12-18 09:22 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] wordsleadmeon.livejournal.com
Sisabet...I love you. Seriously! You're one of the people on my friends list who are just too awesome for words to do you justice...there should be a holiday or something...

Or you know, I could just be in need of sleep in order to come up with something realistic...

And don't worry, totally get it, and totally understand the annoyance factor. While most of my Whedonverse shippage isn't of the slash variety, I definitely do see it, and am endlessly amused by it. Like you said, sadly...some people will never get it, no matter what we do. I even have bi and gay friends who don't seem to fully understand Angel...but yeah...watching Destiny the other day, 'cause Space aired it, and dude...some of the lines in that flashback scene when he first meets Spike...just...how can you think anything else from that alone?

Date: 2004-12-18 03:56 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] crazywritinfool.livejournal.com
People will either get it or they won't. And if they won't, they just *won't* and there's not much you can do about it besides slam your head into the wall. And that hurts, so don't do it.

But I know where you're coming from. I always get a warm little fuzzy when somebody emails me and says, "I was never into slash until I read Disclosure," or, "I just didn't get the m/m thing and then I read Dark Callings and then I was totally all over it." But there are always the folks posting stuff like well, your second book was interesting but I wanted him to end up with the girl. Or, Ewww, not even going to read that stuff. And they can't be converted. But that's okay. Because I really really don't get the BDSM thing that's going on on those same lists, and the folks going gaga over the big Alpha dominant men tying up the women and treating them like crap and making them slaves on a distant world where all the women are slaves and it's okay because it's fantasy...

Oops. I really didn't mean to rant. Apologies.

**slinks away**

Date: 2004-12-18 07:55 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sisabet.livejournal.com
But I understand what you mean -- and also the feedback that is meant to be praise but is actually a backhanded compliment...For every email I have ever gotten about Closer stating that they never really got it until they saw that vid - I'll get another stating that they enjoyed the vid *despite* the slash or, and I will never ever forget reading this, the girl on the Twop boards who *rec'd* the vid and then stated that she preferred to look at it as merely A/S parallels and did not really see the slash. I guess she missed the entire "fuck you like an animal" thing. And I really tried to get that across - ya know?

My penny on the current debate.

Date: 2004-12-18 05:30 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] thebratqueen.livejournal.com
One of the things that drives me nuts with that too is the supposition that any gay interpretation of the text is incorrect simply because it's gay. Because rare is the time that anyone can argue that without the underlying reason being "Because I find it icky to think of Angel being queer."

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