Dammit. I Done Went and Vid-Meta'd: POV. What Is It Good For?

[sisabet]

Lots and lots of talk about POV today. I am not in a very vid meta-y place and for once this is a very good thing. I will say this:

Most songs that have lyrics already have a Point of View. As a vidder - it is up to you to determine how this will be interpreted. "I" and "you" lyrics of course can be easy indicators of this to your audience - but not always necessary. The point of view does not have to be a particular character. The POV can be God. Or a group of people. Or a bracelet. Or a sword. Or as Luminosity once memorably remarked when we were discussing a potential vid that I will still do to the Angel episode "Sleep Tight": "It is from the diaper's POV!"

Whatever it is - it is very important. Not to the audience - either they get it or they don't. Make peace with that now. Establishing where you are approaching this vid is important for *you* as a vidder. It gives you something to cling to. It gives you something to build around. It gives you a vehicle to drive the message home and to give meaning to your vid.

Is this vid going to be first person singular? It is. Okay - will we see the character talking? We will. Cool. Alright - will this be a tight first person vid? Will the vid only show the moments in canon that the narrator has witnessed? Or does he know everything? Is the POV first person omniscient?

And so on and on and on... the questions never stop because until you have a clear view regarding what your song is about (and the point of view of the song is one of those absolute core things that you just have to know. It doesn't have to be what the singer intended. It has to be what you know in your heart that this song is really and truly about) then your vid won't know what it is about, either.

And we can use these things and toy with them within the vid to greater highlight what we are doing. Will everyone notice? Nope. Maybe 2 people will notice. But a lot of the audience will get it subconsciously, but that is how most of us incorporate and distill information anyway, so YAY!

The song is your blueprint. Seriously. Blueprint. It gives you everything. If it doesn't and you can't mix it up enough or cut it or whatever to make it what you need? Then you are suffering from poor song choice my friend and there is nothing that can be done to save you. Trust me. It happens. I should post an example. I don't want to post an example cause then you will all know that I suck, but I should post an example.

POV - point of view - is the delivery mechanism. This is how you get whatever it is that you want to get across, across. Does it have to be a conventional POV? NO - but it has to *exist* - it has to be there otherwise you just get a bunch of pretty pictures that ultimately mean nothing.

And I said I wasn't gonna get into the vid meta and dammit. It is just... look - most people watching your vids are not gonna think twice about "Well whose POV is this?" anymore than most people reading your fic are gonna say "Aw man, I hate stories told in second person!" This is because most people just do not stop and think about everything. Some do.

So - some people are gonna read a story and comment that it had POV problems. Other people are gonna read it and say "Eh, I didn't like it" and that is that. Same for vids. The numbers are a bit more skewed but trust me. Subconsciously is the total way to go.

Comments

[permetaform]

There is a story being told to the listeners.

Exactly.

But what is a story?

And can't you learn someone's story by simply being around them, instead of forcing them to *speak*?

Still, you need some perspective, balance, shape in the vid/painting.

Yup! And I'm arguing that it's called 'intent' rather than POV 'cause POV implies narrative.

But you need to have some tools/technique or approach that helps the viewer to understand what you (aka the vid aka the painting) is saying or the mood you are trying to create, otherwise, you're doing Pollack or Picasso style painting -- and that style is much harder for someone to absorb in an only 3-5 minute space of time.

Yes, and I think that by restricting 'intent' to narrative terms restricts the tool-box you have available to convey information.

I would argue that keeping a narrative structure or POV (in vids with lyrics) helps the viewer absorb your meaning/goal/intent better.

And I don't disagree with this argument, I'm just saying that it's not the *only* way. POV isn't necessary, it's arbitrary.

...

dude, I feel like I'm arguing against my parents. ::wry grin:: or for women's lib.

Perception is reality.

[morgandawn.livejournal.com]

Deep into meta here. I agree with you that the narrative form/story form is only one way to communicate with people. Music can be non-narrative. Art can be either. Free form poetry etc.

In a music vid, with its time constraints, you are limiting your reach/appeal by leaving or abandoning the narrative form. So rather than viewing this as an either/or or even as a discussion where the POV/narrative approach is somehow forced onto vidders & viewers, think of it as a descriptive discussion. We are describing cause/effect or the impact our choices can have.

With every choice we make, we shape our audience communication. Can you make a non-narrative vid? Yes, you can. Is POV (narrative) necessary. No it is not 'necessary' - but without it, you leave a large portion of narratively focused viewers behind Is that a bad thing? No. You may get a lot of 'huh' reactions.

Please bear in mind that unlike written media where the viewer/reader can go back over and over at their own pace, until they are satisfied with their level of understanding, a music video is bound to be communicated at 30 frames per second and is over within 4-5 minutes.

Looking back, I see a thread that is as old as writing/art/music itself - how to balance the art form with audience communication. It was an issue in the 60s where many artists wrestled against conventional story-telling methods. And it will continue to be a discussion you will have with the next generation when they point out that your approach to art is too restrictive or linear- now that we all have those nifty implants in our heads so that meta tag info can be shared on multiple levels.

Perception is reality. At least in quantum mechanics it is.

Re: Perception is reality.

[permetaform]

In a music vid, with its time constraints, you are limiting your reach/appeal by leaving or abandoning the narrative form.

Agreed. But my argument is that by maintaining the narrative form's supremacy is sometimes limiting. Both narrative and non-narrative forms are valid, but narrative form shouldn't be the only form of communication in a vid that is appreciated.


So rather than viewing this as an either/or or even as a discussion where the POV/narrative approach is somehow forced onto vidders & viewers, think of it as a descriptive discussion.

...but...that's not really why I started the discussion. I, in my original post, was talking about process and about conceptualizing that process. The way that process was being defined is sometimes too restrictive for what the process needed to do.


but without it, you leave a large portion of narratively focused viewers behind

Not necessarily. What I'm thinking of here is laurashapiro's vids, which she says in my initial post that she rarely considers POV during the construction of the vid. I believe that a good non-narrative vid has the flexibility to allow the audience to give it a POV should they want/need one.


Please bear in mind that unlike written media where the viewer/reader can go back over and over at their own pace, until they are satisfied with their level of understanding, a music video is bound to be communicated at 30 frames per second and is over within 4-5 minutes.

yeah, and thus because of that same time limitation, alot of the information of the vid is transmitted subconsciously, and sometimes the best way to communicate subconsciously isn't narratively.


Perception is reality. At least in quantum mechanics it is.

Hee! And when you percieve something, you sometimes change it, too.

Re: Perception is reality.

[laurashapiro.livejournal.com]

To clarify (again): I meant that I don't *have* to think about it, because the song gives it to me. Everything I do once I know what the song is doing is instinctual and subconscious. That doesn't mean that I don't put the POV into my vids -- I do. I just don't have to wonder about it at length, because it's inherent in the song. That has a lot to do with the kinds of songs I choose.